Episode Transcript
[00:00:13] Speaker A: Greetings and welcome to Simmer and Gabby preseason special. Rob Simpson along with Bruce Boudreau and man oh, man, we are ready to go for the 2023 24 hockey season, are we not, Gabby?
[00:00:28] Speaker B: Well, it's been a long time coming, it seems, but I'm looking forward to hockey again, that's for sure.
[00:00:34] Speaker A: Well, we're both very busy individuals, so for our podcast, it's 26 minutes hardcore, and we've got the stopwatch going 26 minutes. Now, in honor of the number 26 for this week, I'm going to bring up the name Joey Kosher. One of the Bruise brothers in the late eighty S for the Detroit Red Wings once cracked a helmet with a punch. Good old time hockey in the late 1980s. Joey Kosher, ladies and gentlemen. Who do you got, Gabby?
[00:01:05] Speaker B: Well, once you said 26, the only guy I initially thought of was Barry Melrose, who wore 26 when I was with the Leafs back in the day.
[00:01:16] Speaker A: And you went through a few numbers, I understand.
[00:01:19] Speaker B: Yeah, unless I've been told wrong that I held the record for most Leaf numbers in a career, which is really rare considering it was really kind of short. I had five different numbers, so every time I got called up, they gave my number to somebody else and when I'd get recalled back up, that guy had my number, so they'd give me something else.
[00:01:47] Speaker A: Do you remember them all?
[00:01:49] Speaker B: I think 1112, 1719, and 32. 32 was my last number because who the hell is going to wear 32? So, I mean, that was the last time I got called up. 19 was the one I wore the longest, and I think 17 was for very short period of time. I think 17 might have been the playoffs where I only got called up for the playoffs and then eleven and twelve were both scattered in there somewhere.
[00:02:23] Speaker A: If you had your choice of those five, which one would you go with?
[00:02:26] Speaker B: Well, 19. I wore 19 my whole career, everywhere I played, except for when I got called up with Toronto. So, I mean, that was my number.
[00:02:37] Speaker A: All right, we're going to be talking about the Vancouver Canucks on this program here, and I'm still in the cabin in the woods preseason mode for the moment, but the Canucks, of course, boy, changes being made, obviously you're very familiar with that, Gabby, having gone through what was a painful sort of situation last season. And here we are in the start of a new season with Rick Talkett. What is your general impression of some of the changes that they made? For example, OEL's gone. Luke Shen's gone. They bring in Carson Susie from Seattle. They bring in Ian Cole. Does this really just come down to Thatcher Demco healthy?
[00:03:17] Speaker B: Well, I mean, I think one thing there's, every team in the NHL goes through changes every year, and when you don't make the playoffs, you probably go through a few more than you would normally want to go through. Example Vegas, I don't think went through maybe one change from their Stanley Cup team. But when you don't make the playoffs, you make some. But I mean the key is always going to be Demco. I mean, as is, the key is always going to be the goaltender for your team. If your goaltender is better than average, for the most part, you win more games than you lose.
The previous year, Thatcher was outstanding.
Rajulov cutting in deep centers. Oh my goodness, what happened there?
[00:04:09] Speaker A: Did Ben miss or did Demco scroll.
[00:04:11] Speaker B: And make that save? I think we were 17 games above 500 in the time that I was there. So, unfortunately he had surgery in the summer and I don't think he was quite ready for camp. And he got injured in game 13 and he was, I mean, you'll see a great Thatcher this year, but he was probably subpar and he'll be the first one to tell you, in his first twelve games of the season last year.
[00:04:41] Speaker A: Well, there's a famous saying, of course, show me a great goalie and I'll show you a great coach. Right? I mean there is a certain element to that.
[00:04:49] Speaker B: Well, there is.
I'm sure that every coach, the first thing he wants to do is make sure his goaltending is above board because it's hard to recover from goaltending that is a little bit substandard.
[00:05:04] Speaker A: I just wrote an article for Vancouver Hockey Insider that talks a little bit about last year and this year in this way. I'm going to read you a quote.
You can talk to everyone over the next two weeks and they all want to get out of the gate. Well, the head coach said the great learning curve on that is that they didn't get off to a great start last year and they saw what happened and how frustrated they were when they thought they were a playoff team at the end of the year. But they weren't in the playoffs.
Rick Taka could have said those very things. That was you.
And you followed that up with missing the playoffs would be a big disaster. You finished up 30, 215 and ten, exactly what you said, 17 games over 500. Rick Tockett finished 2012 and four, eight games over 500, but still that similar type of, oh my God, here we go. We got everything's going to work now.
Hear that. And you look at it right now. If the same things go south early in the season, he's going to be in the same boat you're in.
[00:06:14] Speaker B: He will be. But I mean, again, he was handpicked by both Jim and Patrick, so I don't think he's in quite the same boat.
[00:06:24] Speaker A: Yeah, and also you got kind of thrown under the bus after your goalie got injured, which they later apologized for, but obviously that didn't help things matters moving forward for you, which made it crappy.
[00:06:41] Speaker B: It made it crappy. It's no fun to lose. And I think the fans in Vancouver deserve to win. I mean, they're as loyal and a fan base as you want to see, especially as a Canadian fan base. And I've only been as a coach in Vancouver. They were outstanding. And I've always said it didn't matter to me.
I was one of those guys that I loved the critiqueness of the fans because I was always thinking positive. So I wanted to make sure that if I can get this right, if we did good, I wanted to be successful, and it was great. But if it was bad, I wasn't running away from that. I was embracing the challenges that we had. But obviously, it didn't quite work out the way I wanted to last year.
[00:07:41] Speaker A: Right.
Okay. All that said, this season we talked about the D changes. We talked about make sure you get healthy goaltending up front. Teddy Blueger in some way, shape or form is basically last year it was Curtis Lazar. They plugged him in. This year they plug in Teddy Bluger. They add p. S suter.
Ilya Mckayev is hurt again. So ultimately, has it changed really that much? There's no horvat. Obviously, Anthony Bevillier is a new face since last season. Part of the way, are they better or are they the same?
[00:08:18] Speaker B: Well, I think time will tell.
I think they all want to be better. They all want to be positive. I know that group of forwards, and none of them like losing. I mean, they're a pretty good group as far as sticking together and everything else. But time will mean I think the biggest thing last year is when they traded Jason Dickinson.
Before the last preseason game, we didn't have a third line center. Now, I thought initially we would have we had Horvat, we have Pedersen, and we had JT.
But when JT Was asked to be moved to the wing so then we only had two centersmen, and there were young guys. Nels Alman was a young guy, and he wasn't expected to make it out of camp, but his work ethic proved that he deserved to be there. And whoever else, Curtis Lazar was brought in as a center, but he was a better right winger, so we moved him to right wing. So I think the depth at center was a little bit at the beginning, wasn't as good as maybe we would have liked.
You know, I think there's not a lot of difference in the forwards. I think Brock Besser was hurt at the beginning of the year, and I don't think he ever got on track to be the player that I think he can be like. I mean, this year you're being removed from his father's passing and the health, I think he will be much better. I think Kuzmenko started off fairly slow, but once he got going, he was really good, and he scored in the first game. But I mean, as far as knowing the league, he knows the league should be he should be dynamic from the start. I think this year, Petey, he's in a contract here, and I think he's one of the best players in the mean. I watched him so closely, and his intelligence and anticipation and everything else that goes with it, from the willingness to want to be the best to thinking he's the best, which is a great combination, is second to none. So I believe, like, I think their next preseason game is against Edmonton. He'll want to play against Conor McDavid every shift. So I think he's starting off in a position where he can't wait to play, whereas the year before I think he started off with a sore wrist and it took him a long time to get going, but once he got going he was great.
[00:11:13] Speaker A: He also started out by missing training camp with Quinn Hughes because they're both represented by Pat Brissant and Travis Green started he had those two missing. They showed up in time to start the season. And of course, when you just brought up the contract, it's so, you know, do you get the impression that Pederson as good as he is and as much as he loves playing and as much as he has confidence, is he taking a wait and see attitude to maybe move on to somewhere else? Do you have any feelings there?
[00:11:44] Speaker B: I don't have any feelings there. I just think he's a very confident young man and I have no idea on the he wants to win. He wants to win. We all want to win and you're never going to see a player in any sport say, well, I just want my money. I don't care if the team wins or not. We're all going to say we want to win and that's the most important thing. But I mean, I believe he wants to win, but I believe he wants what he thinks he's worth too.
[00:12:16] Speaker A: Yeah, the semi ironic thing about that earlier discussion about centers and you brought up Niels Oman is right from the horse's mouth. They're looking for another young center because you have Pedersen and you have JT. Miller. It's a pretty good little duo there.
[00:12:34] Speaker B: But one two is really good. And I mean, they got Ratty in the trade, who was a first round pick that matter of fact, when the Islanders came in and played us when I was still there last year, he scored a goal, one of his few goals that he'd scored all year. And so I think they're expecting him to take a leap but they don't know Blueger can play center who'd they get. PS. Suter.
He played pretty regular the last two years at center, so I think maybe they've already upgraded in that position to start the season right.
[00:13:11] Speaker A: What's your overall feeling on Connor Garland? Feisty little water bug winger comes to.
[00:13:17] Speaker B: Play every know he was never on the first power play unit and I think he was on the first power play unit in Arizona and he got a lot of points there. But a competitive little guy, like a really likable young man. And I think that he's got a really high hockey IQ and I think he wishes he was just one step quicker and his shot was one a little bit harder. But I mean, I think he's a perennial 15 to 23 goal scorer in this league, especially if he's going to be used in the top six as the top six forward with Vancouver.
[00:14:06] Speaker A: Funny thing is he's already a little guy and he uses that shaved off cut stick.
[00:14:11] Speaker B: It's really short. And I've never been a fan, not whether it's him or whoever else that I've seen with those small sticks. I remember know Vancouver people will remember the name Daryl Sittler. When I first joined Toronto, he came up to me and he said, you know what? If you want to be a really good player, you got to use a longer stick. And it makes you stick handle from further away and using your speed. And you can make moves. You don't have to get right in tight to make moves. So from that moment on, I didn't all of a sudden add two inches to my stick. But over the course of that year I did add length to my stick and it became easier to shoot the puck and a stick handle.
[00:14:59] Speaker A: Yeah, he likes it because he's in close. He can almost like turn with it against his body in corners and stuff. But you do see him struggle with shots sometimes and one timers are often impossible because you just can't get leverage.
[00:15:11] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean you can't have everything perfect the way you want it, but he's really superior below the circle or below the goal line at twisting and turning and he's hard to get. So, I mean, if that helps him there and it takes a little bit off his shot, you got to give and take on some part of your game all the time. And that's probably where he's I can't think for him, but he's probably relied more on that's, his game of twisting and turning and getting loose behind the goal line rather than being in the slot taking shots, which sometimes he gets a hold of it and it goes really good. But it's just not as good as you would like to see on a normal basis.
[00:15:56] Speaker A: I want to get into the Pacific Division where the Canucks maybe stack up there a little bit this coming season, but just a couple more here specifically on the Canucks, jack Rathbone has been this guy that's been hanging around lots of expectations since, I'd say pretty heavy expectations since probably 2021, 4th rounder back in 2017. He's been seeing time in the preseason already. This time, I mean, what is it, what is it and is the clock ticking? Is time running out on this kid out of Harvard?
[00:16:29] Speaker B: Well, before I got there, the year before, he had a great year in mean I think he was over a point a game, and everybody thought that he was going to be a shoe in. And the problem is he got, I think, two concussions that year, and I think it put his development back the beginning of last year.
I think they wanted to make a commitment to him.
Mean and he started out and gave him the opportunities and opportunities. Then I started sitting them out a little bit, and then I just remember before the Montreal game that before he got there was about four or five games in a row. I said, I'm playing him every game. Let's see what he's got. And he was just struggling. I think a lot of it was confidence when you're used to scoring and you're used to making offensive plays and all of a sudden it's not happening, it really takes away from the rest of your mean because that's what you're known for as an offensive player. And hopefully this year or when he went back to Abbotsford, he regained that confidence because he's got a great shot. He can read on the power play, he can make a really good outlet pass.
Whether his defending is good enough or not, that's going to be the question that everybody wants to see in preseason. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he sees four or five games out of the six. The Canucks are playing right, and of.
[00:18:08] Speaker A: Course, we're talking about Jack Rathbone, a left defenseman who for a while, they thought they would slot in behind Quinn Hughes somewhere. Oliver Eckman Larson kind of threw a little mess into that, of course, being the veteran on that left side. So it was like, do we really need a Jack Rathbone on the big league club, considering the talent, skill sets of those two guys? So timing.
[00:18:30] Speaker B: Ian Cole can play the right side and has played a lot of that in his past. I mean, he's a left shot. Carson susie has played the right side, even though when I had him in Minnesota, I thought he was much better on the left.
Mean, they do what they want now, but I think he's a better left sided defenseman than a right sided defenseman.
[00:18:54] Speaker A: By the way, could be Quinn Hughes'partner on the right. And Takit has brought up the fact that they might share a little time with Huggy, with two different guys, maybe on the right side because no one's going to match his minutes, or maybe they don't want somebody to match his minutes. But Susie, you said he brought up to me during preseason informal skates, that he played the right side, Minnesota, just like you said, but I guess you're worth rolling the dice.
[00:19:21] Speaker B: Well, when we got him, he started in the playoffs, and he played every game in the playoffs. I think it was his first five it was his rookie season, but it was his first five games and he played left side and right side because we had three 3D out in Minnesota in that first playoff round. The next year, I thought I played him mostly on the left side and I thought he was a better offensive player than people give him credit for. And I've always asked him to be a little bit more aggressive offensively. He's a six foot five guy that's big and strong and will hit, will center ice, open ice hit. He will fight when he has to, but he's aggressive by going down the boards and keeping pucks in. I thought it was a great get because I really liked him. I thought his growth was really good. I was really surprised that Minnesota let him go after a year. So I think he should be a really good they've been it's funny, I don't know him at all, but teams have been writing him off for the last three years. He just goes out and plays and gets resigned and does a great job for any team he goes to. So those two guys, I think, are really going to help the team. I think that makes them an awful lot better defensively on the left side. And if you look at it, other than Quinn Hughes and other than Tyler Myers, they don't have anybody back from the eight defensemen that they had the previous started the previous year.
[00:20:52] Speaker A: Yeah. By the way, Jack Rathbone is into the final year of his contract, 850 grand, and he has arbitration rights at the end of this coming season. Any advice for Rick talkt in general in the market? I mean, he was here since you left, but any advice for him as he starts this season? Just in general.
[00:21:12] Speaker B: He's been coaching long enough. He doesn't need any advice from me, and I just wish him well. I mean, it's a tough but fair market. If he does good, he's going to be a hero, and hopefully it starts out good for the Canucks. And they got a tough little schedule. I think they start off back to back against Edmonton, but I remember last year it was a tough first five games, and Jim always said he hated Jim Rutherford, didn't like five games on the road to start, and so they changed it. The first game is at home and then I think the next five are on the road, but I'm not 100% sure. I haven't followed their schedule that much as of yet.
[00:21:59] Speaker A: Right.
We only have about four and a half minutes left. Gabby here in honor of Joey Kosher and Barry Melrus, 26 minutes.
Just we'll talk again before they drop the puck. The start of the season, because we're basically two weeks away from opening night.
Are the Calgary Flames going to bounce back now that Huberdo maybe is settled in there and maybe things Daryl Sutters out new coach in what do you think in general?
[00:22:31] Speaker B: Well, you know what, in general they got a really good team. If Markstrom plays the way he did two years ago, they're going to be a playoff team. They were one of the best teams in the league. I really believe so. I mean, if Huberdo, who will guarantee have a better year for whatever reason. Maybe it's just the fact that he started off his first ten years in Florida and there was an adjustment, and that happens a lot of the time to well, I think Cadre will have a better year. And I don't know if it has much to do with the coach. Whatever you didn't like about the coach, he was won the Jack Adams the year before, so he must have done something right. But I think I've always thought they had a really good team and I think this year they'll bounce back and have a really good year and there won't be any excuses for them.
[00:23:24] Speaker A: I think there's going to be kind of a bubble situation going on. I think Calgary is going to be better than that. I expect to bounce back from them. I think Seattle is going to be in that little group with Vancouver, they're going to be duking it out for that spot, Ian Cole with Vancouver, brian Dumalin is going to try to bounce. He had a 25 point year last season but bounced back maybe defensively after playing 82 games.
He's in Seattle. So you got the two teammates that were cup winners in Pittsburgh in that division and then of course, you have Susie jumping up across the border and.
[00:23:57] Speaker B: I don't think Seattle is going to catch anybody by surprise this year. And that's another thing. I look at Vegas. They didn't start playing till the All Star break. I mean they were in the midst of who was going to make the playoffs and who wasn't going to make the playoffs until the All Star break and then they took off like crazy. So I think they're there. I think Edmonton, everybody has sort of given them the yeah, you're the best, and I mean, they'll have to go out and prove it right from the start, but we will see about whether Edmonton can do it. But they certainly have the talent. I mean, I think their forward list is as good as anybody and so I think the Pacific Division is really tough this year. I think every game is going to be a battle and it'll be interesting to see who comes out on top.
[00:24:47] Speaker A: And naturally we come full circle from where we started to where we finished and that would be Edmonton. Stuart Skinner, Maddie Beniers ends up winning, the Calder kind of going away, but Stuart Skinner is a Calder finalist and it's going to come, let's face it, end of the day, it's between the pipes again, end of the day.
[00:25:10] Speaker B: And it's been proven when you've got the best players in the world and you're looking at Connor McDavid and Dry Cycle, if you look at Pittsburgh, since they've won the cup in 1617, every year it seems like it's okay if Tristan Jerry is good, Pittsburgh wins. I can go down the road with the Leafs. Everybody said the same thing about their goaltending being that's the question mark. But I mean, if you have great goaltending, you have a chance to win. The Canucks have great goaltending when he's on and when he's healthy, and they have a really good goaltending coach. So I really believe that if that's your Demco can play. And you know what the other thing, too is? I think with Casey dismiss, they got a bona fide NHL goalie as a backup. If in case anything happens, take nothing away from Colin Delia or Spencer Martin. But I mean, they were young guys put into a tough task last year, and I think the Vancouver goaltending is much better to start the year than it was, say, after game twelve of last year. So, I mean, it'll be really interesting to see what happens. I expect them to be a tough out every night.
[00:26:22] Speaker A: Yeah.
All right, the buzzer sounds 26 minutes. Simmer and Gabby, by the way, real quick, who's the hottest, maybe not the best goalie ever had, because you're obviously washington, Anaheim, et cetera. Who's the hottest goalie you ever had?
Any moment, just a run.
[00:26:43] Speaker B: Well, you know what? It's crazy you ask. Neither one were NHL goalies, but both of them, Travis Scott and East coastly was the MVP. We won the cup. Freddie Kasivi was the MVP. We won the cup. And the two times we were in the finals and we didn't win the cup, we faced Patrick WA and Kerry Price. So goes to show you how I think about goaltending.
[00:27:13] Speaker A: That would be the Kelly cup and the Calder cup. Yes, Calder was hershey. Where was the Kelly?
[00:27:20] Speaker B: I was in Mississippi in the East Coast Hockey League and then the Seawolves and then the other two kerry Price played for hamilton won it. And Patrick WA's rookie year was in Sherbrooke, so they won it.
[00:27:39] Speaker A: Gabby, great stuff.
[00:27:41] Speaker B: It's good talking to you.
[00:27:43] Speaker A: Good talking to you, Gabby. Simmer and Gabby will talk to you next time. Thank you very much. Have a great day. Enjoy the hockey action.
